AOD to T5: Harder then I thought

[OneBad93]

Eric asked me to post a few pics of the current AOD to T5 swap going on with my car right now (apologees to SSOTN guys - you've seen these). The car was born with an AOD and I managed a best of 13.2 at 105 with it. It was a rebuilt stock AOD with a TCI street fighter converter. This is my 3rd AOD and I've had it with blowing these slushboxes up, plus, I wanted to find out about all the supposed fun I was missing rowing my own gears. Since I'm a cheap bastard, I'm using almost all used parts, the surgery started April 7th. For a complete list of mods to my sled, check my amateur attempt at a website (http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt).

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/dashapart.jpg
this was hard to watch, I knew it was necessary but I began
to think we'll never get this stuff re-wired correctly. We had to relocate
the speedo cable, which was the reason for this mess.

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/onjackstands.jpg
we poor motorheads can't afford a lift, we would attempt this
surgery on our backs.

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/t5parts.jpg
T5 parts from friends all over the east coast started to arrive

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/usunder.jpg
the dead AOD fought us for hours and did not want to come out....

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/aodout.jpg
finally the AOD corpse was out. A reputable trans shop thinks
I blew an "intermediate sprag" causing the AOD to have only 1st
gear and occassionally 2nd.

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5/AODshifter.jpg
the AOD shifter also did not want to leave, but eventually we
got this stubborn piece out

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/mess.jpg
ugggh....I hated this. Honestly I started to second guess myself
when looking at this mess, what had I done?

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/aodpedals.jpg
rumored to be the hardest part of the swap is the pedal swap -
no shit, the rumors were true, even getting the AOD pedals out
was a bitch

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/clutchin.jpg
under the car, the work went easier, the clutch bolted right up

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5.jpg
Friday my rebuilt T5 arrived

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/kirkstarter.jpg
I couldn't have done this without my close friends Bill and Brian.
Here Brian bolts up the starter.

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/tumaspedals.jpg
Bill tackles the pain in the ass pedal install. This job would be easy if
any of us were 5'-3" and 140 pounds....

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/t5in.jpg
Finally the T5 is in

http://www.homestead.com/rich93gt/files/tunnel.jpg
We had to cut the tunnel because the shifter bolts are too far forward.
Watching someone take a air whizzer to my car made my genitals
curl up...

Surgery continues this week

[fast88]

thanks alot for posting this rich.......tech articles like this are hard to come by.

the other rich 8)

[my95GTHO]

Glad i decided to not do that!!!

[OneBad93]

AOD to T5 Swap complete.
I'm glad I did it, no regrets.

A couple of observations:

1. the car seems louder
2. the car seems way...WAY faster....more torque
3. I can now chirp or smoke the shit out of drag radials while driving
4. you can feel how pissed or happy the engine is through the vibration in the stick (cool!)
5. finally the car sounds like the billions of other 'stangs out there
6. clutch smoke stinks and stays in your cloths / hair
7. picture this: loud black shiney car, shiney wheels, NASTY on the plate...stalling in a crowded intersection
8. downshifting at a roll and gettin on it....second in fun only to sex
9. the stomach-churning suspense of will this rebuilt AOD shift is gone.
10. the stick just looks cool.
11. I forsee a new clutch in a few months
12. the days of driving home after having a few drinks is definitely out now, this shifting biz
requires all my concentration and coordination

It's like I bought a new car, this is a totally different animal in feel, sound, ride and appearance.

[mustangkiller]

I was thinking about doing the 5spd swap this winter but after seeing some of your pic's :shock: I think I'm scared now lol

[dodgestang]

I see we share some similar photo op moments.

http://www.dodgestang.com/images/repull3.jpg

[frdfandc]

Actually, the hardest thing about doing the 5 speed swap is the pedal assm. Its a PITA. Everything else is cake.

[blown1989saleen]

damn! your ripping your AOD out and im hoping to put a AOD in(Erics as a matter of fact) :wink: nice tech stuff man, good job and enjoy rowing those gears.


Scott

[tiny4lx]

I did 3 of these swaps. At first i thought it was going to be a bitch but it wasnt. One thing i noticed you pulled the dash apart for the pedal assembly. What i did was just pull the colum out alittle and majic started. But glad to see your finished and happy.

[OneBad93]

One thing i noticed you pulled the dash apart for the pedal assembly. What i did was just pull the colum out alittle and majic started. But glad to see your finished and happy.

We did that for several reasons:

1. we had to swap locations of the speedo cable and clutch cable

2. I have been wanting to remove and clean the inside of the cluster for a long time.

3. We wanted to re-wire the Autogage tach a little better.

Update: the car has run great for the last 7 months and then finally the $35 used "learner clutch" (as my friends call it) gave up. Currently the trans is out again and getting a thorough rebuild including bearings, syncros and forks. Other than the speedo mysteriously dying (turned out that the plastic drive gear inside the trans moved) everything has been great and I can't wait to get back on the raod again.

[tiny4lx]

OOO ok i wasnt downing ya i just wasnt sure why. I know what you mean whaen you say clean behind dash. Cool i can say when i did mine it was a world of fun.

[RdRunnr]

Another awesome swap article is here (http://www.wcfords.com/articles/tech/t5swap/t5swap.html).

[rel3rd]

Just to touch base on Rich's nice tech article...

If you remove the console section that surrounds the AOD shifter, the AOD shifter comes right out. I've heard of quite a few people fighting their's, and another 5 minutes of disassembly (front console removal), would eliminate that.

I also noticed that the article RdRunnr linked to says you cannot interchange the speedo gears, when in fact you absolutely can. They ARE different, but I have re-used the speedo gears (at least temporarily) without any issues. Some of the AOD speedo gears have a long tip on them that can simply be snipped to allow install into a T-5 tranny...Just an FYI...

[OneBad93]

I agree Bob - Tumas assured me console removal was a snap, but I was scared and elected not to. If I had to do it again - I WOULD remove the center console.

[Bane]

yea I just did my aod-t5 swap and after fighting with the aod shifter for a hour I went ahead and undid the couple bolts that hold the console on and the shifter came right out haha

[paul nieto]

If your not making alot of power then the stick is the way, and alot of fun. if you want to go gast and consistant the auto is diffenitely the ticket. High 10s with stick is o.k low 10s with stick is a handful.

[ThrashN]

I'm doing the swap right now. I got the pedals and spedo cable done. I have to save up for a clutch and MGW shifter then I'll swap the trannys.

Dash ripped apart to rerun the spedo cable
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-74379-Picture_002

Brake pedal removed
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-10741-Picture_006.jpg

New pedals in
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-54095-Picture_010.jpg

The pedals suck getting in and out, even the single brake pedal was a pain in the ass.

[sallystrothers]

Another awesome swap article is here (http://www.wcfords.com/articles/tech/t5swap/t5swap.html).

Anyone have that article saved somewhere? It appears to be no longer hosted. I'm doing the swap right now and have finished the pedal install and speedo reroute but could use some help on the tranny install.

[jackalope5o]

reviving...

did you replace the AOD harness with the T5 one?

...debating on doing the swap but to a TKO 600

[86droptop]

I'm doing the swap right now. I got the pedals and spedo cable done. I have to save up for a clutch and MGW shifter then I'll swap the trannys.

Dash ripped apart to rerun the spedo cable
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-74379-Picture_002

Brake pedal removed
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-10741-Picture_006.jpg

New pedals in
http://www.svtcobraltd.com/iB_html/uploads/post-1-54095-Picture_010.jpg

The pedals suck getting in and out, even the single brake pedal was a pain in the ass.

Im gonna be going back to a auto in my 84. Ill have a MGW for sale very soon that has 9 track passes and less them 200 miles on it. Get ahold of me Doug either on here or on penn. Hell Im gonna have a complete T5 set-up for sale or trade for a AOD set-up.

[50fanatic]

How did you mess up the aod 3 times? Too much 1-D-1 shuffle? lol

[Jeremy]

I was wondering if you need a 5 speed computer to do the AOD to 5 speed switch?

[OneBad93]

How did you mess up the aod 3 times? Too much 1-D-1 shuffle? lol

Yup that's exactly how I did it.
Back then i was obsessed with going as fast as i could and the shuffle was good for 2-3 tenths...no shit

[OneBad93]

I was wondering if you need a 5 speed computer to do the AOD to 5 speed switch?

We retained the AOD computer and 6 years later I've had no problems.

[gator72007]

---------OneBad93---------

In the First post you said with the AOD you ran a 13.2 at 105. What did it run after the T5 swap?

[OneBad93]

---------OneBad93---------

In the First post you said with the AOD you ran a 13.2 at 105. What did it run after the T5 swap?

Well I ran 13.397 @106.09 largely due to the fact that Mr. AOD boy didn't know how to drag race with a manual.
Eventually I got the hang off it and got down to 12.71 @ 107 but GT40 Iron heads were also added so it's tough to tell how much of an improvement the trans alone yielded.

http://www.nasty93.com/19964075-M.jpg

[Tig]

How has it been treating you?
What was the cost to do the complete swap?
I'm thinking about doing this swap.
What are the HP capabilities of a T5?

One more question. What is the difference between BWs T5 and Tremecs T5? I know tremecs reputation but what about Borg warners?

Great write up.
Thanks

[Tig]

random question = Is the TV cable used in a manual tranny car?

[OneBad93]

How has it been treating you?
What was the cost to do the complete swap?
I'm thinking about doing this swap.
What are the HP capabilities of a T5?

One more question. What is the difference between BWs T5 and Tremecs T5? I know tremecs reputation but what about Borg warners?

Great write up.
Thanks

How has it been treating you?
Awesome. The stick is way too fun on the street.

What was the cost to do the complete swap?
Well, I had a special situation - friends did the job for beer. Used parts (nothing was new) were about $600

What are the HP capabilities of a T5?
I really don't know.

[Tig]

Thats great man, glad its going well.
Thanks for the info, I appreciate it.

One more question = Do you happen to have a parts list of whats needed for this swap?
Thanks again

[Stuart]

random question = Is the TV cable used in a manual tranny car?

Nope. Nothing to control.

[OneBad93]

One more question = Do you happen to have a parts list of whats needed for this swap?
Thanks again

As best I can remember:

T5 Transmission
Fluid
Crossmember
Transmission Mount
Bell Housing
Bell Housing Bolts
Block Plate
Clutch
Flywheel
Flywheel Bolts
Rear Main Seal
Throwout Bearing
Throwout Bearing Retainer
Clutch alignment tool
Clutch Fork
Clutch Quadrant
Clutch Cable
Neutral Safety Switch wire harness
Brake light wire harness
Firewall Adjuster
Clutch Pedal / Brake Pedal assembly
Shifter
Lower Boot
Upper Boot
Plastic console Bezel
Shifter Knob

[Stuart]

Pilot bearing, dust cover, elbow grease.

[Tig]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the help and info.

[Tig]

Can someone answer one question.
What are the weak points of a T5?

Some that I have heard are
1) weak case
2) third gear, not quite sure what this means but, one of the kids I work with said 3rd gear is weak.
3) power shifting - what exactly is power shifting? shifting without using the clutch, correct?

Thanks

[backinblack]

Can someone answer one question.
What are the weak points of a T5?

Some that I have heard are
1) weak case
2) third gear, not quite sure what this means but, one of the kids I work with said 3rd gear is weak.
3) power shifting - what exactly is power shifting? shifting without using the clutch, correct?

Thanks

Powershiftin-- Holding the gas to floor and keeping it there, not backing off when you shift.. If your good it sounds amazing, I'm too old and uncoordinated to do that .....

Check out this link of a cute girl doing a great job at it -- http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=STyKLlkAiLQ